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jasfish

mograph.net RIP?

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i think this board is about the same as always - even though I am fairly new to it. Its wide open, and that is why it flourished. And I don't really get the anti-noob stance people have. If you are going to start policing this site, then you really will kill it.

 

if people ask questions that you don't like, don't read the post. If people aren't intersting enough for you, either be interesting yourself or move one to other things. If you want a closed group, well then just instant message each other. I don't know what else to say.

 

This site is a great resource. Its a place to post your work, a place to ask advice from your peers, and a place to learn. Its also a place to joke around and have fun with other people that may share your point of view. Why do you want to set limits on it? I have learned a lot from this site, and because of that I now work constantly.

 

If you only want to see reels or WIP, then go to the proper section of this board. If you don't like shit talk, then don't go into the lounge. Its pretty simple.

 

People need to settle down. You have guys calling for moderation that are telling people to shove it up their ass. Wtf? Is that for real? You see the irony, right? 'Keep the noobs out, and then we'll be fine' - you get that the post was a joke drawing a parallel, right? Jokes. Why get all crazed?

 

or...you can accept the fact that things change, and if it no long suits you, you can change too.

 

Personally, I love the fact that I can be at a job and using C4D for the first time, ask a question and have a few posts in minutes. That is invaluble. You got guys like Sao dropping wisdom from his years in the biz - you don't get that shit in school. You get it here. Good luck finding that on 'Feed'. You get C.Smith giving you free C4D tools and guys like Monkey and Chinaski dropping wisdom and showing you tests that might inspire you.

 

How is that dead? You have really smart people willing to share, and that sets this place apart. Plenty of places have tutorials or the latest from studio 'x', but this place will set you straight as well - and its because of the uncompromising critiques and a wealth of knowledge. If you just want to see the latest cool without shit-talk, then you really have come to the wrong place.

 

Hell, I posted my first reel here a while back, and still get work offers from people just because of that. How is that dead? If you post a reel that isn't half bad, people literally will find you.

 

People just need to deal with the fact that the word is out - people know about it. People are lurking, and some nda's are frightening. That combined with 15 hour days = less posts

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Because it is. Sorry buddy, but having technical posts, inspirational discussions, politics and the mograph.net-friends network pop up all in one forum section is not my idea of a well structured forum. Call me a stiffnecked German bureaucrat if you must, but I feel part of the problems for mograph.net come from the fact that people don't know where to go with their questions and the forum itself isn't taken care of.

Then let me enlighten you: This is 2006. It's as simple as that. Searching the web for info is easy as pie, people have fast connections and compared to 1993/1994, when I started doing 3D, there are about a bazillion websites more. So assuming anybody is seriously interested, it is not to much too ask to go hunting for information. you know, many of those really stupid questions are so obviously simple, it is quite clear they didn't even look in the manual and that is something that I absolutely can't stand. It is the kind of people who just want to make their life easy at the cost of other people doing the work for them.

 

In addition to that, it baffles me how much naivity can be found with some of those people. They can't even manage their OS, yet they call themselves "artists" and try to work with professional apps? Something ain't right there.

 

Lastly, and this really gets me, you all are insisting that mograph.net is a high profile site. It is not. Structural and organizational issues aside, you all are far too much becoming part of that "noise" that has made this site so unattractive. As I already wrote in another reply, you don't stick to topics, have nothing better to do than posting fun pics or sending mysterious messages to friends by means of a public forum. A high profile forum powered by high profile people should not suffer those problems, should it?

 

You are all being divas and as much as the COW may be lo-fi, this doesn't happen there. I don't get backfired with stupid comments and people are even thankful for what little of my limited knowledge I share with them. This makes posting there a much more pleasent experience after all.

 

And let me set the picture straight for you once and for all, boys: I'm the diva here. Being cynical, sarcastic and arrogant doesn't befit you. I can do that much better and beat you everytime, so spare me your distasteful jokes, insinuations and comments on my personality. It's simply not your place to tell me how I shall live my life.

Ha, and there you go. Again you are confusing form with substance. Can you be sure the Wiki will be that great? Do you know who is going to contribute? Sorry, Wiki's are a trend, not a way of information management and I don't see it becoming anything particularly noteworthy for mograph.net - I've seen too many empty ones to believe in that hype any longer. I'm not saying the COW is perfect, but presumably anybody who is really willing to learn something, will find the tutorials, no matter whether they are not sitting on your nose. most people are simply not looking hard enough because they are too lazy or too stupid to understand what a search function is meant for - a commonality shared with mograph.net, I believe.

 

Mylenium

 

 

Stiffnecked german bureaucrat.

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Guest Sao_bento

Mylenium

Well, I love you, too. Shove it up your ass and be done with it.

 

Mylenium

wtfau ?

You might notice that Mylenium is German, and might take offense at such imagery (as well as understand what the words mean).

 

 

 

On a separate topic:

In general, the primary thing Mograph.net is about is having a place to talk freely and honestly. There are no sponsors to offend, no revenue to damage, only some loosely defined rules to hold it all together. Possibly some added freedom via the anonymity of the internets. It's not meant to be a virtual version of a documentary where the director or editor tries to steer the direction or mold things into a coherent story or structure - It's just pink anarchy. It's definitely a community thing, so the longer you are around the more you'll get to know the personalities of the other members. It's really not a big deal. It's just here, people can choose to come or not.

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Is 3 years really long enough for you to get tired of your career?

 

that is about how long it takes for an art/design school grad to become partly, or entirely, disillusioned about his/her specific field. by then they fully understand that genuine creativity and innovation are not default ingredients in the majority of projects and that someone must usually fight with vigor to ensure that those things are included. after three years, many become tired of being the one fighting, and start to look at their job as more of a paycheck than a source of creative fulfilment. of course there's nothing at all wrong with that, but even a mild case of such disillusionment will result in lower enthusiasm for your specific field. and if someone isn't experiencing creative frustration, and instead it's being rewarded and welcomed, then they are probably busy as shit hell and barely have enough time for even a real physical world personal life. also, if you get a staff job at a name shop, then your posting on forums like this can become a liability if you trash talk any peeps or especially other shops' work. and i suspect that there are at least 20 people reading the site daily for every 1 person who posts.

 

i have to say that this forum has had a hugely positive effect on my work. i hadn't been very involved in mograph work since 1999 (back then, designinmotion.com played a big role in inspiring me to push my work farther), and after moving to sanfran, quickly found myself doing mostly print, interactive and even more live action work than mograph. but the last few years the mograph work started to pick up a little and i started to wonder if the industry would ever pick up enough to make it the biggest slice in my pie chart of income. then about a year and half ago, i was visiting a friend that was working at current, and i saw crabbey (some spikey-haired brat stranger) reading some pink website with the word "mograph" at the top. when i went home and found the site, it was like on fraggle rock the first time you saw them go out that hole that leads to the world with those big 7-foot-tall douchebag hairy plump royal family characters and the talking garbage heap with the banana peel on her head. for seriouslz, it changed everything for my career plans. being up in the crummy mograph territory of sf for 6 years, you become brainwashed to thinking that all mograph projects must either consist primarily of using shine, be completed in 6 hours, or if you're lucky, be an endtag logo that will appeal to soccer moms. just seeing that somewhere, someone is getting paid to make awesome, innovative shit made a world of difference. and it made me aware of how high the bar is for reels, which i had completely lost touch with.

 

and since those bastards of current's gfx dept (past and present) got me addicted to more than just the reels section, i am pathetically hooked on the pottymouth straightforwardness of this site, and probably will continue to, since i freelance from home all by my lonesome now.

 

and with all seriousness, there are few pro forums of any field where there is feedback beyond backpatting and uberpolite vague ctiticism and where there are pros with truly good work giving input. all the oneliners and cursewords are just a natural byproduct of the frankness that we value so much when it comes to critiquing. besides, complaining that something that's free and on the internet needs to be more regulated and organized is pretty silly.

 

thankerz to mograph.net for showing me what time it is.

oh, and sao bento is totally the fragglerock talking garbage heap guru character.

Edited by jaan

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You might notice that Mylenium is German, and might take offense at such imagery (as well as understand what the words mean).

 

I'm from germany too. I still think that this pic is funny as hell.

About the meaning of the words: Schnitzelkraut is really just a made up word that's meant to sound so typically german. We Germans are often being called Krauts abroad and Schnitzel is one of Germany's favorite meals. It's not really that offensive. More like a test. Germans that can't laugh about this are taking themselves too serious. That's my opinion.

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Guest Sao_bento

I'm from germany too. I still think that this pic is funny as hell.

About the meaning of the words: Schnitzelkraut is really just a made up word that's meant to sound so typically german. We Germans are often being called Krauts abroad and Schnitzel is one of Germany's favorite meals. It's not really that offensive. More like a test. Germans that can't laugh about this are taking themselves too serious. That's my opinion.

You know, that international community thing constantly bites us in the ass, so I assumed this was another case of the same. Farfegnugen to you and glasnost to all my comrades and camaradas.

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this site is about making MO-TION GRA-PHICS. Not rocket science, not finding a cure for AIDS, not feeding third world countries. so who are you to say that a forum that addresses art/tech/whatever u have an issue with in a single post isent worthy of your time? is what u do that important? fuck that. become an doctor or a laywer if u want to take work as seriously as u sound. this is a free forum, fuck having strict rules on who can post what and when and where.

 

i never insisted on mograph being a high profile site. i DO insist that u will find more TALENTED, HUNGRY, and MORE INTERESTING INDIVIDUAL people here in DAY than you can find in cow in a month.

 

does it suck when the same shitty questions come up? of course! but YOU are the one who has seemingly designated themselves as fit to teach the world about...whatever u see fit in the world of television graphics. its great, there are alot of people that benefit from your advice, im sure. but it strikes me as odd that you would be the one to come and whine and bitch about it.

 

and yes, there is a commonality that the cow and mograph share with new users. so what. there ARE idiots in every field. who cares. you let them know whats up, and thats that. they either a.) learn and do the proper thing, or b.) become an accountant. both of which have little relevacnce to anybody that posts here.

 

jaan you have a very insightful post.

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which is a damn shame since you're the best freestyle mograph rapper here

 

 

It's been a long time, I shouldn't 'av left you

Without a mograph rap to step to.

Sayin' this site is RIP?

You better listen to the VIP.

 

The hack attack smack down,

left you like a clown, in the gutter coughing blood with nothing left to muttter.

 

When times are hard an shit's hitting you the most,

the only thing to do is post.

 

Peace, out, 2006

Respect to all you mother fuckers.

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I'm from germany too. I still think that this pic is funny as hell.

About the meaning of the words: Schnitzelkraut is really just a made up word that's meant to sound so typically german. We Germans are often being called Krauts abroad and Schnitzel is one of Germany's favorite meals. It's not really that offensive. More like a test. Germans that can't laugh about this are taking themselves too serious. That's my opinion.

 

It's not funny. Charlie Chaplin doing Hitler is funny. Louis de Funes doing Hitler is funny. Not that. Next thing you'll do is posting a Stalin picture entitled "He saved us from Hitler". Realize that none of this is funny. Too many people have died and the words "Never again" matter too much to make fun of it. I'm sure the glorious Fuehrer would have loved to have you shot just for that little caricature.

 

Mylenium

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I think there are two different types of forums that people visit. The first is the kind where you know exactly what kind of information you want, and the forum had better be strictly organized or you won't get it. The second kind is one that provides an informal exchange where the destination isn't always as important as the conversation that gets you there. Why is the journey more important?

 

Editor Walter Murch (sorry, some of you may be cringing right now) occasionally bemoans the effects of non-linear editing having triumphed over linear editing. Now that it is all done on computers, you can call up whatever clip you want at the touch of a button. On some old reel-to-reel film machines, you would have to fastforward or rewind through up to hours of footage to get to the desired clip to put it into the film. That can be percieved as a hassle, but the benefit of such is that by scanning through all that footage, you find buried gems, gems that you didn't realize were there until that particular search. Gems you wouldn't find if you get exactly the clip you want at the touch of a button.

 

For me, that's what Mograph is. I find little pieces of information all over the place here, and answers to questions I never thought to ask. I don't mind when things go off topic, because sometimes where the conversation goes is way better than its intended destination.

 

Heck, I also enjoy the banter. It gives the place personality.

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Too many people have died and the words "Never again" matter too much to make fun of it.

 

Too many people have died and the words "Never again" matter too much to not make fun of it. Make fun of the victims? Hell no! Make fun of the "Führer"? Hell yeah!

 

I'm sure the glorious Fuehrer would have loved to have you shot just for that little caricature.

 

Exactly. So?

 

P.S.: you're turning this into a political discussion, making this thread look unfocused, unmoderated. You don't seem to give a shit about staying on topic. You hijacked this thread, breaking flow of this discussion. That's pointless. I would really appreciate if you got a hold over yourself and showed some more discipline in those matters.

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::salutes igor:: here here to the oldest member of mograph (and one that still posts)

 

P.S.: you're turning this into a political discussion, making this thread look unfocused, unmoderated. You don't seem to give a shit about staying on topic. You hijacked this thread, breaking flow of this discussion. That's pointless. I would really appreciate if you got a hold over yourself and showed some more discipline in those matters.

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Too many people have died and the words "Never again" matter too much to not make fun of it. Make fun of the victims? Hell no! Make fun of the "Führer"? Hell yeah!

Exactly. So?

 

P.S.: you're turning this into a political discussion, making this thread look unfocused, unmoderated. You don't seem to give a shit about staying on topic. You hijacked this thread, breaking flow of this discussion. That's pointless. I would really appreciate if you got a hold over yourself and showed some more discipline in those matters.

 

Bugger off! you started it, now live with it.

 

Mylenium

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No, I didn't. I just made fun of you by portraying you as a mad, angry, typical german. That's not really political, is it?

 

It's nice to see you are placing so much value on stereotypes. Well, byebye then. Ignore list awaits...

 

Mylenium

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lol this is the best thread since 2003.

 

but seriously jaan, this paragraph:

 

that is about how long it takes for an art/design school grad to become partly, or entirely, disillusioned about his/her specific field. by then they fully understand that genuine creativity and innovation are not default ingredients in the majority of projects and that someone must usually fight with vigor to ensure that those things are included. after three years, many become tired of being the one fighting, and start to look at their job as more of a paycheck than a source of creative fulfilment. of course there's nothing at all wrong with that, but even a mild case of such disillusionment will result in lower enthusiasm for your specific field. and if someone isn't experiencing creative frustration, and instead it's being rewarded and welcomed, then they are probably busy as shit hell and barely have enough time for even a real physical world personal life. also, if you get a staff job at a name shop, then your posting on forums like this can become a liability if you trash talk any peeps or especially other shops' work. and i suspect that there are at least 20 people reading the site daily for every 1 person who posts.

 

holds a lot of truth

Edited by Fred Camino

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It's nice to see you are placing so much value on stereotypes. Well, byebye then. Ignore list awaits...

 

Mylenium

 

Some people just happen to fall into those stereotypes.

 

Bye! Sniff. I'll be missing you. :(

Edited by igorschmigor

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Bye! Sniff. I'll be missing you. :(

 

Not in a million years, I'm afraid.

 

"Of all the things I could drown in,...., crocodile tears are the least appealing"

 

Bester, Psi-Cop, "Babylon 5"

 

Mylenium

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Wow... its taken me a while to get through this thread.

 

I think the hack has taken a big toll on the forum. I for one have been less motivated since my account was deleted although lately I am trying to make an effort. It would be a shame if this place had to die.

 

That comserv spot by Shilo was awesome. Thank you for that Sermon. Its made my day.

 

As for Mylenium, just stfu and go back to the cow. I hate the cow so much. The whole layout of the forum and design of the website is so horribly gash. If you don't like it here then piss off.

 

Hah... i love this place, i love the sarcasm and the brutal honesty.

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Although being somewhat vulnerable as a software guy trying to please everyone, I thought I would chime in here.

 

I have met Mylenium in person, and find him to be an open, (brutally) frank person who speaks his mind on the topic at hand (something I admit to thinking is a good thing...even if I don't like it). To me, this firebrand honesty is what many are claiming in this thread to be the benefit (and perhaps entertainment) of this forum.

 

Does this mean that you should slag him for who he is? Dissent Yes. Disagree - fire away. Nationality, politics, race etc though....not cool in my book. Even if trying to impart some inside joke, not everyone will get it. (The whole global internets thing)

 

No offence - but this has degraded a really good thread into crap.

 

Steve

Citizen of Mighty Peoples Republic of Canuckistan.

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To me, this firebrand honesty is what many are claiming in this thread to be the benefit (and perhaps entertainment) of this forum.

I'd feel more sorry for him if he hadn't greeted me over at CGTalk with the same intolerance he's displayed in this thread. Honesty is one thing and greatly respected here, but he's displayed a great deal of arrogance, which at mograph.net is punishable by mockery.

 

So be it.

 

-m

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I'd feel more sorry for him if he hadn't greeted me over at CGTalk with the same intolerance he's displayed in this thread. Honesty is one thing and greatly respected here, but he's displayed a great deal of arrogance, which at mograph.net is punishable by mockery.

 

So be it.

 

-m

 

And what thread would that have been? By which Alias do you go there?

 

Mylenium

 

As for Mylenium, just stfu and go back to the cow. I hate the cow so much. The whole layout of the forum and design of the website is so horribly gash. If you don't like it here then piss off.

 

Hah... i love this place, i love the sarcasm and the brutal honesty.

 

Ah yes. More design speak - form over substance. Lovely seeing so much essential info being added to this thread.

 

Mylenium

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I think your definition of substance and mine differ greatly, so this argument is already irrelevant . But for arguments sake, with so much information (or substance) available to us now, then I think form is crucial. Form is what makes the experience a pleasurable one and form is exactly why I love design. If form didn't matter then us designers would all be out of jobs.

 

I like this board because its different to the cow and cgtalk and all the magazines available, that tell me how to push all the buttons in photoshop.

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I'd feel more sorry for him if he hadn't greeted me over at CGTalk with the same intolerance he's displayed in this thread. Honesty is one thing and greatly respected here, but he's displayed a great deal of arrogance, which at mograph.net is punishable by mockery.

 

So be it.

 

-m

 

Although I haven't seen that thread - I do admit to subscribing to another rule....goes around .....comes around. I just don't like race/nationality/etc slags - even if meant as an inside joke. There's just no point to it.

 

Steve

High Priest Archbishop of the First Canuckistan Republic

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