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Dr. Jim

Spec work for freelance bids? Your thoughts...

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I'd be interested in an AE:LDN Meeting. I guess the key is to getting a venue and sponsorship, like AE:NYC meetings, that's how they can keep them free. They also have great speakers at the meetings.

 

In terms of location, it makes sense to have it in central London. I may look into locations that could accommodate, say 25 people for starters.

 

@Guera - have you found anywhere that could be suitable?

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I'm up for a London meeting. Would enjoy meeting some top design talent in the city. I've found it very difficult to get to know the freelance talent pool in London unfortunately. Sometimes my projects (and their budgets) require a really fine designer/animator, not every project requires full agency engagement.

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I'd be up for a London get together. I'd prefer something that was across the mograph scene and not just about one bit of software. No offense to the AE groups, but a night devoted to 3D Stroke is not my idea of a good time.

 

As for the spec work - I'm happy to do boards for clients, but when they start talking about tweaking this or that without even narrowing the field of candidates my answer is no way. And I have to admit this policy came about from bad experiences - not from my own good judgement.

 

W

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As a freelancer I would never do pitch work or design/boards for free,

no matter how good the project.

 

I cannot believe people actually agree to do this, it just seems like bad practice to me.

Why encourage it?

 

 

-d

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I've been getting 2 emails and a phone call in the last 24 hours regarding SPEC work.

I have to say something is strange, it feels like someone spread a rumor about me muahahha...

 

being booked till april I can only say its quite amusing, but I guess this increase in demand only means that some people have already agreed to do spec work and thats why the request for FREE MOTIONOGRAPHERS is spreading like a virus.

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As a freelancer I would never do pitch work or design/boards for free,

no matter how good the project.

 

I cannot believe people actually agree to do this, it just seems like bad practice to me.

Why encourage it?

 

 

-d

 

 

here, here.

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Hey Bakahatsu,

 

I am doing this Mograph/Animation meeting in London for 6 months already. Would be love if you can come to the next one and bring more people.

 

I used to get better paid and a lot of the companies start pay a bit less now. I got a lot of it last year. I don't think it is a big deal for the companies, but it is bad for us. I think it still few places paying normal rate for a senior designer, but a lot of them are paying a bit less. I can't complain to much, but I have a lot friends that are working for less to keep busy.

 

I don't think anyone need to bend a bit to get set up as a freelance in London. It is a lot work around, you just need to show yourself, keep the good work and try to meet more people. It is all about networking and another reason why we need to make the meetings happen.

If everyone helps everyone, we can do good and keep the market right.

 

imcalledandy,

 

It is not just a AE meeting... what I am trying to do is a proper mini event, a Mograph/Animation event.

I know it is about the venue... I had this problem with the first months of the meetings, but I got the venue now.

It is a 2 floor gallery and we will have the whole place to us. I am changing the meeting for every 2 months, so I can plan better.

It will be a mini event where we will have a projector with someone talking and showing work and after we carry one with music and drink.

This change will start on 26th of March with the new Mograph/Animation Meeting and we will be screening the new Psst! Pass it on 3 in London.

We are working in some posters/fliers to send around and a website...it is all coming together.

I need get sponsor for the events, but until there I will be paying for it.

 

Denny Tu,

 

feel free to come over and bring everyone with you. We are doing the meetings already, and I spent some time this year to make it better.

I hope people help, the only thing I ask everyone is to come around and bring more Designer,Animator,Director, Motion Designer...

 

Kokosing,

 

that is the plan... it is a Mograph/Animation Meeting, not just AE.

 

I agree with you about the spec. I just think when it is for 3/5 people pitching it is ok, but then they call 15 people...it is really a lottery.

 

 

yoni bendor,

 

yes, I think it is spreading like a virus and getting more and more. I get scared that in the future will be the only way to get a good work.

I hope I am wrong.

 

 

HERE IS THE POST FOR THE ONES THAT WANT TO JOIN THE MOGRAPH/ANIMATION MEETING

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I pitched some design work for a project that will remain nameless for a "respected" agency. Complete waste of my time.

 

As a company I pitched an ad concept to an actual client and won the pitch and made the ad.

 

My feeling is that if you are pitching a complete concept with you a creative director in a take-it-or-leave-it fashion to an actual client, then both sides can benefit.

 

Pitching a bit of design to an agency as part of a bigger project sounds to me like the in-house creative director is lacking his own ideas and being indecisive and you would not want to work with them anyway.

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Spec is bullshit. It's all a poker game, and they're waiting to see who folds first. I think you just have to approach every job with the

comfort that you could lose it simply by asking to be paid. Otherwise it's a vicious cycle that never ends.

 

 

I agree with this mindset, because its not a black and white issue.

 

People will talk all tough on forum boards (myslef included) about how we never do spec work, fuck them, I'll throatpunch anyone who asks me to do spec, etc etc.

 

But in reality, way too much free work is being done. That's where intelligent discussions on boards like these are very helpful. If for some odd reason you are doubting your own gut feeling, hitting up a forum or some friends is key. At the very least you'll get some better language to help your side of the negotiation, or my personal favorite - a good quote. Such as:

 

"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amatuer" - Red Adair

 

"Art is skill, that is the first meaning of the word" -Henry Geldzahler

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I pitched some design work for a project that will remain nameless for a "respected" agency. Complete waste of my time.

 

As a company I pitched an ad concept to an actual client and won the pitch and made the ad.

 

My feeling is that if you are pitching a complete concept with you a creative director in a take-it-or-leave-it fashion to an actual client, then both sides can benefit.

 

Pitching a bit of design to an agency as part of a bigger project sounds to me like the in-house creative director is lacking his own ideas and being indecisive and you would not want to work with them anyway.

 

I've had a very similar experience. I helped a client create storyboards for a pitch to a network. Mostly her ideas, but we definitely brought a lot to the pitch. In the end, she got the job, but the network instructed her to use a different graphics house.

 

The moral of this story: ONLY PITCH TO THE DECISION MAKER.

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I've had a very similar experience. I helped a client create storyboards for a pitch to a network. Mostly her ideas, but we definitely brought a lot to the pitch. In the end, she got the job, but the network instructed her to use a different graphics house.

 

The moral of this story: ONLY PITCH TO THE DECISION MAKER.

 

I wish...some of us are anxiously waiting (looking) for the next gig, sometimes the situation does not let you choose your toppings.We just have to "Bend it like Beckham"(especially in District :o )

Edited by stoiqa

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