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Guest tother

Camera movements (mk12)

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Guest tother

I would like to hear some of your thoughts on how the camera movements were created by mk12?

 

Brazil,Infinity and the one with the mouse.

 

AE camera, maya camera, boujou???

Its so damn organic, looks so pretty!

 

Also thoughts on how to make all the scenes match up (the seemless execution), like in the infinity reel.

 

I'm a comp artist and love motion graphics, I have a good understanding of it but not great. Any insite would be super!!!

 

Thx, Jason

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Guest igorschmigor

i don't know which one is "the one with the mouse", but about Brazil and Infinity: i'd be surprised if they used an 11000 € tool like boujou 2D3 to make some simple camera rotations. I guess they used normal Maya cameras. I must say i wasn't quite as impressed by the camera animations, they look good but not "how-on-earth-can-this-possibly-be-done"-good. I believe they did some camera tracking for ultraloveninja. Although i am not familiar with Maya i'm sure it has it's own camera tracking system for that type of thing, cause even 3D Max got one.

 

I'm not sure what you mean with "seemless execution"?!

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Guest tother

Howdy, the one with the mouse is (Untitled_EMBRYO). What I mean about seemless execution is the way it all fits together like its all one element.

 

I though as you did that they 3d tracked some footage and used the camera data within maya or ae. but how would thay have made all the elements. like in infinity, camera flys all over slows down or stops. graphics start animating, camera starts moving to the next scene. It just dumbfounds me. Did they build it all first or build it scene by scene using the camera data. I have tried to mimic it to learn the how to's. I've used ae's camera and its not even close. I know its easy, just have to visualize it.

 

Also would you be so kind to send me some info on your right-on type tutorial (ultralove text). The website seems to be having issues, all the pages are page 1.

 

Thx, Jason

 

mail@jasontoth.com

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Guest igorschmigor

i think the real secret is: they use some MAGIC. :wink: They probably used some camera mapping for Infinity (no idea what it's called in Maya, that's the MAX term), the technique has been mentioned a few times in the type-birth thread. They create some geometry that fits the silhouettes of the scenes, create the camera animations first, make the geometry move to the correct positions, so that in the frames where the camera stands still the geometry comes together to form the scenes' silhouette and then do the mapping. That's what i think. One Way for making the shapes keep their proportions on a 2D screen in spite of placing them in different distances to the camera is to move the vertices along the cameras' z-axis. I hope you know what i mean, it's a little hard for me to explain.

Although i think i can guess some of the techniques it's still awfully well made and i believe it really is as hard to create as it looks (maybe not to them, but they're not from this world).

about the MK12-type tutorial: if you had read the type-birth thread a little better you'd know that i lost the files. But you're excused for not having read it all, it's become a monster thread with too much to read in one go.

 

i like your avatar

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Guest igorschmigor
Guest tother

Thanks for the help on this. I really didn't think of camera mapping. I'm going to give it a go. I was tring before by chopping up the video and positioning it in z (it was very painful and barly worked, ae's camera is hard to control).

 

About the text, yeah i got lazy and missed your post that you lost it. I'll give it a try with the brief discription you gave in that post.

 

Thanks for the kind words on my avitar (found it somewhere, i shit my pants when it animated and said thats what i want).

 

Do you have any work/reels posted anywhere? I'd like to see some of your work. I'm a VFX compositor and you can view some of our work at:

 

http://artifexstudios.com/portfolio.html

 

Later, J

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Guest igorschmigor

hey you worked on some big films there. Me, i don't have a portfolio, i'm a student and actually not even planning to do anything in that direction, it's more like a hobby to me.

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Guest tother

Its fun and pays the bills but at times??? Like the one I'm having now, FUCK THIS SHIT. In production if things don't work (even though its not you fault and you can't do anything about it) you get blamed and bitched at. The shit always flows down stream. I know every industry has its issues but the film industry is out of control. Stupid old school bureaucracy. Sorry to vent, its just been a rough 9 months for me. Its a love hate relationship (and to let you know I have a great/open minded attitude, so I could emagine being an ass hole in this industry (or maybe its better to be one so others don't try and stick it to ya).

 

Word of advice: stay in school,drink tons of booze and love the ladies

 

cya, Jason

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Guest say*uncle

tother...

 

i'm from vancouver aswell and know exactly how you feel about, " shit always flows down stream." attitude in the film industry. the pay is good but it just doesnt feel worth it at the end of the day. oh well such is life.

good luck to ya. :D

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Guest timmy

brazil inspired was all after effected.

 

untitled 02: embryo was all after effected. i think there was a pipe or something that was in maya.

 

untitled 01: infinity was after mayan effected. i think a 60/40 split... i don't remember. it was forever ago that this happened.

 

we're working on a new short film now. it's entitled MK12's History of America. there are cowboys and astronauts in it.

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Guest tother

got a question for ya well more like a request. since ya did most of the camera moves is AE, ya got any tips? i have a hell of a time working ae's camera, its probably just user error. anyway,some quick tips on brazil would be cool, if not no worries :)

 

also, sorry to anyone who read my above post. i'm not a bitter at the film industry. i came to the conclusion it was because of bad management. i have since left that job and everything has been amazing!

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Guest timmy

so the brazil piece was built in a matter of something like two and a half weeks. it was a very quick production schedule because 1) it wasn't a money maker and 2) we had money makin' jobs with deadlines that needed to be worked on but they weren't as near as fun in both concept and production as the brazil inspired piece was.

 

so the quick of the short: nando of nakd.tv was creative directing the book put out by DGV. originally, a dvd was supposed to accompany the book but ya know, funding, costs, who knows stopped that and the book was published al a carte. this was found out after the fact. moving on. so dretzka was busy with our friend eric, makin' the print work. and me, matt, jed, ben and shaun tried to figure out what we were gonna do for the animation side of things.

 

so it was decided that "machismo" whould be the subject. deforrestation came in a close second. so off with the animtion. except we had no idea what machismo was about. so we called up many a brazillian, mostly friends of friends to get their input as to what machismo actually was, how it was viewed in the past and the present.

 

we taped the phone interviews and then someone had the idea of animating the phone interviews...

 

so we went with one voice, nando's brother. we cut his interview down to a workable audio track.

 

each of us had a chunk of audio. we all worked from the same image resource folder we collected earlier, compounded on top of what dretzka already had gathered for the print work.

 

oringally, everything was in black and white. going back to the (print) idea that if it didn't work in black and white, it won't fucking work in color. everything was tinted after the fact with hsv values of orange and green. this was also helpful in covering up the seams, in going from each individual cut from the other...

 

style boards were made. style was chosen.

 

as far as rules for the animation... we decided to hold camera movements to a 45 degree rotational axis. but from there, it was all improv. whatever was said was then visually represented by the animation.

 

so BAM! and days later, clips were finalized and we sat around making said clips fit together. shaun then created the audio after the initial full cut was made, matching the animation...

 

and then we called the concept graphic journalism.

 

the end.

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Guest timmy

hopefully, this year, nando and DGV will put out the dvd of all of the brazil inpsired animated shorts. this would be great as it sucks at looking at things on 320x270 windows as well as a number of these shorts are not available to see and the interweb.

 

so keep those fingers crossed and lets hope that this great amount of work will find it's way onto shelves...

 

also, i'm sorry i didn't divulge further tips and tactics with aftereffects and camera moving and tracking, masking, keyframing, filters, open/save etc. etc. etc. it's the secret sauce, ya know? but really, anyone with a kitchen, ingredients and the time can figure out what the fuck they put on that chicken; so goes the same with the action graphics.

 

we don't make extra value mealed "styles" or anything like that, to which we, or a client can say, oh, i'd like style 1, super sized, with a hint of element(s) B-G.

 

we don't template things. we just make art and we move on to other interests. for example: the infinity piece wasn't meant to be a style or introduce a "style" to the world to copy or figure out. simply put, the flow of the infinity piece was the easiest route in expressing visually, the idea of a 4D timeline.

 

yeah? neat. i'm gonna go make things move now...

 

timmy

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Guest fredcamino

whoa, timmy, thanks for all the great info. quite an insightful look into the kansas city process. keep your recipes to yourself anyhow, it's a lot funner to walk into that big bad kitchen armed with spatula, whisk, and nothing more. sure i usually tend to just make a mess and end up throwing everything away, but everyonce in a while something comes out that's edible. well, with enough ketchup on the side.

 

let us know when that dvd "drops", and I can't wait to see MK12's history of america's space cowboys.

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Guest mr.Squiggle

Another me too post to thank timmy for taking the time for that insight. Hope you can do it again next time mk12 astound us. Nice simple effective moves in the adidas spots.

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Guest timmy

yeah, that job was fun. it was a quick turnaround. we did the "visual effects" to the first spot, Lessons 1. and the kids at the agency liked it and us and gave us a chance for full editorial and creative control on the second spot. so that was nice.

 

it was also nice to be able to incorporate a couple of theories and themes (a 4D timeline in a 3d space, viewed on a 2d transmitter) transplanted from in house workings to a client job. not a style mind you, but the theory. also, it's also goes to show what good content (that we didn't shoot) can do for a simple looking concept.

 

yeah, outside of rotoscoping a shitload of stuff, it was pretty easy going.

 

lessons 2 is also another example of more of the extemporaneous type of animation of the mk12...

 

timmy

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