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JamesDohertyEsq

3D theory

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So for c4d I'm doing fxPHD training, reading the manual and looking at some tutorials..

 

Feel like i'm progressing along ok, BUT I do feel like I'm lacking principle 3D theory.

It's all well and good knowing exactly how to use specific tools in cinema there are things that I feel like I should know, some things I've found out by googling, some I'm still not 100% clear on.. things like:

  • In detail: When are quadrangles, triangles or N-gons better?

  • If I'm using the kinfe tool to model things, where should I cut, to an existing vertice if possible or is it ok to just make new ones where it suits?

  • Other than just flipping the normals of an object and seeing what happens, why and how should they be aligned?

  • I know Phong, Blinn etc are better suited to different materials, but how and why?

I'm not asking you guys to answer these questions, it's more that I know that for everything that i'm aware I don't understand fully there's probably 10 things i'm doing wrong ignorantly.

 

What i'd like is some good 3d general theory.. In the form of a book, website, video, whatever. Just feel that my current training is preparing me for various tasks but not giving me a good underpinning. Anybody got any good resources?

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In detail: When are quadrangles, triangles or N-gons better?

Triangles are at the very heart of every polygonal modelling. All Quads and N-Gons will be internaly reduced to triangles at rendertime. On the other hand they are the most useless thing for modelling and using triangles on organic and especialy deforming characters will lead to artefacts.

The general rule is to use N-Gons for technical modelling and don't care about reducing them to quads or tris. This way the internal triangulation can create the optimal mesh for each situation.

Quads are the prefered option for deforming objects/characters since they offer the best deformation solution and the fewest artefacts.

If you create n-gons during character modelling you usualy try to resolve them into quads, but depending on the situation that is not neccesarily needed.

Under any circumstances you want to prevent the use of triangles in deforming objects. Especialy elongated tris will make your life hell at rendertime.

 

If I'm using the kinfe tool to model things, where should I cut, to an existing vertice if possible or is it ok to just make new ones where it suits?

This totaly depends on the situation and model, afaik there is no golden rule.

Other than just flipping the normals of an object and seeing what happens, why and how should they be aligned?

Different to real objects polygonal surfaces have no thickness and therefore no defined surface. Inverted normals will lead to shading errors, and incorrect UV mapping. You should always make sure that the normal of a polygon points towards the outside.

 

Cheers

Björn

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Sorry matey but you're at the foot of a tall mountain! If you're looking at the Gnomon stuff you'll realise that it's a loooong painful process. I was lucky enough to be instructed by a friend patiently, who explained that not everything has to be neat (or 90 degree straight), planes can intersect, everything was as usual a deception pandering to a camera. There's a really good 3D concepts manual, non app-specific, by Focal Press, look it up on a certain online bookstore.

 

You'll go through hell initially (I still can't get my head around UV texturing - makes certain freelance projects pant-wetting at times) but like learning Cinema 4D in German, it gets suddenly easier after a huge horrendous project is over.

 

If you really are at the start of the whole 3D thing, why not go for Maya and get your teeth into a proper beast of a program? Here in London even graphic designers are asked to use c4d, it's that easy.

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@Srek Thanks Srek, I had a few inklings that you confirmed there.. Appreciated!

 

@iline I am actually a graphic designer in London, and I agree it is fairly easy! I don't intend to ever work fully as a 3D generalist of anything more specific, just want it to compliment my 2d animation work.. I'm reasonably competent at motion graphics using c4d, working with type, nurbs and mograph mainly. All of those are fairly simple and it's more a case of understanding how to adapt those tools to my mograph needs.. Having said that I also would like to be able to do some more advanced stuff. I'm playing with box-modelling and more advanced shading/texturing at the moment and it's here that i feel my understanding is a little lacking, although I totally get away with it with the day-to-day mograph stuff. Is this the book that you're talking about?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-Essentials-Fundamentals-Texturing-Animation/dp/0240814711/ref=lh_ni_t

 

It seems like it might be exactly what I need.. I expect that I already know most of the stuff in it but there's still probably no harm in reading over it, bound to pick up some things that I missed out on that might be helpful..

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Hey James, I recommend checking out the Vertex Pusher tutorials: https://www.vertex-pusher.com/

 

I've found them to be very enlightening when it comes to the type of core 3d theory you're talking about. They aren't so much about making cool looking stuff (a la many tutorials on the net) as they are about understanding the why's and how's of 3D modeling. As such, they can be a little dry (and I've found the audio to be a little quiet on some tutorials) but very educational.

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Cool, thanks Fred..

That sounds like exactly what I'm looking for..

 

Though I generally don't use the Tuts site because they're exactly about making specific cool stuff, I just found this and it helped clear some stuff up about modelling for nurbs. Not for cinema but the same principles apply..

 

http://cg.tutsplus.com/tutorials/autodesk-3d-studio-max/3d_cg_vfx_modeling_autodesk_3dsmax_subdivision_smoothing/

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I started looking at C4d about a year ago so i could get into 3d. I found it really difficult and my learning got nowhere. I am presently at university and have to use Maya. So im learning Maya which is hard but now when i look at C4d i wish i could be using that. I think what ive had to learn in Maya will go along way when i finally start using c4d!

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Hey James, I recommend checking out the Vertex Pusher tutorials: https://www.vertex-pusher.com/

 

I've found them to be very enlightening when it comes to the type of core 3d theory you're talking about. They aren't so much about making cool looking stuff (a la many tutorials on the net) as they are about understanding the why's and how's of 3D modeling. As such, they can be a little dry (and I've found the audio to be a little quiet on some tutorials) but very educational.

 

I second this. Recently started with it and you get a good bang for your buck.

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