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Beaver

No Mac Pro Fo Sho

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if I had to guess I'd say that they have a fairly major redesign/ upgrade in the lab that just isn't going well. Despite their obvious emphasis on the consumer market now, the current Mac Pro situation is just bad business. I can't imagine them planning it this way.

Yep I don't see Apple as money-grabbing in that way. They just stubbornly insist on doing things their way in their own time, like FCPX. Apple aren't a computer company or a gadget company any more than they're a digital distribution company or a luxury goods company. Their thing is using digital technology to improve people's lives and experiences. You might think that's BS but it is roughly what drives their focus.

The thing is, there is really no such thing as 'Pro' anyway. If you're really serious about high-end 3D the Mac hasn't been a Pro option for a decade, if ever. And on the flipside an iMac is absolutely a Pro machine for Photo or audio work that would have required a 'workstation' ten years ago. The clockcycle demands of Motion Graphics just suffers from being poised on the fence between the pro-sumer and the ultra-niche.

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Guest Sao_Bento

"Tim Cook, in an email to a customer complaining about yesterday’s very minor Mac Pro speed bump:

Thanks for your email. Our Pro customers like you are really important to us. Although we didn’t have a chance to talk about a new Mac Pro at today’s event, don’t worry as we’re working on something really great for later next year. We also updated the current model today."

 

- Daring Fireball

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I'm so sick of rumors that tend to mostly be false. It better be absolutely groundbreaking when it comes out, rendering all mac pros before it completely worthless.

 

The only thing worth waiting a year for would be a complete change in the mentality of how a heavyweight machine should be built. There were rumors of the new one being rackable / stackable.

 

Dreaming here, but if we could daisy-chain multiple processor 'blades' in a rack to act as one machine and provide as much power as we can afford to throw at it, that would be awesome.

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Dreaming here, but if we could daisy-chain multiple processor 'blades' in a rack to act as one machine and provide as much power as we can afford to throw at it, that would be awesome.

This.

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I just built up a PC for home because of the whole price thing, 6 core 3930k, 32gb RAM, SSD, 1GB video. I just can't get around as fast as I can in OSX, neither through the file system or in the software. I like to use Quick look + Expose a lot.

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I went through all the phases of loss on Monday. My Dad even used the word "despondent" for himself.

 

SO, after much soul searching, I personally am going to buy Apple's new Retina laptop maxed out on everything, hook it to a couple 27" Thunderbolt displays and a couple Thunderbolt Raids. It won't be as powerful as a Mac Pro, and not nearly as powerful as a lot of PCs out there. But fuck it. It will be OK for the interim until Lucy pulls the football away one more time and I end up just buying one of these.

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Why?!? O_o Hackintoshes make no sense.

 

You know, software runs on Windows too....

 

Yes but ProRes codecs don't and they're becoming increasingly ubiquituous. Running a parallel Hackintosh boot makes perfect sense to me.

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Yes but ProRes codecs don't and they're becoming increasingly ubiquituous. Running a parallel Hackintosh boot makes perfect sense to me.

 

 

Welllll, technically they do. Apple has a Pro Res decoder for Windows and a handful of companies have made encoders for Windows. BUT! It's Windows, enough said :P

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The only thing worth waiting a year for would be a complete change in the mentality of how a heavyweight machine should be built. There were rumors of the new one being rackable / stackable.

 

Dreaming here, but if we could daisy-chain multiple processor 'blades' in a rack to act as one machine and provide as much power as we can afford to throw at it, that would be awesome.

 

 

 

We're thinking along the same lines. A lot of the innovation that makes everything from iMacs to iPhones better than their predecessors doesn't really apply to the Mac Pro. Sure, I'd like a sleeker, lighter case, but that doesn't even register in comparison to performance. When Thunderbolt was announced I wondered if it could be used to link separate Mac Pros in exactly the way you describe, and just have the whole thing work without complicated set up procedures, render management software, etc. Any app would have access to the power of all the connected machines, period. That would be an actual, pro specific innovation that we could all use, and would give Apple an advantage in the pro space that has never really existed before. I'm sure this is a tall order or someone would have pulled it off by now, but who knows?

 

With Tim Cook actually addressing this directly and talking about a great update in the future, it's unlikely we're just going to see the latest processors, etc. thrown into the existing case next year. The question is, how far are they trying to push their pro machines, and how much to they care?

 

I'll probably grab a refurb Mac Pro, a maxed out iMac, or maybe even the retina Macbook Pro as a stop gap since my existing Mac Pro has needed help for a long time now. I may still be swayed to set up a screaming PC, but I'll likely just follow this through to the end, just as Apple wants to me to do. I hate being their bitch, but if the shoe fits...

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Yeah the modular, thunderbolt-node based system could be incredible. Just like I was happy to pay well over the odds (as some PC champions would say) for the operating system, case design and vertical integration of a Mac Pro two years ago, I might also be happy to pay over the odds for the latest Intel processors boxed up in an aluminium enclosure or whatever other form the nodes might take, if the offer as a whole made sense. Apple do leave things to die on the vine sometimes, but when they come out with a genuinely new, re-imagined product they are capable of doing things the rest of an industry hasn't thought of. If we see that next year, great. If not, I'll probably build a Windows box. In the meantime my 8 core is still about 25% faster than the Retina Macbook I just ordered.

Edited by kitkats

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Yes but ProRes codecs don't and they're becoming increasingly ubiquituous. Running a parallel Hackintosh boot makes perfect sense to me.

 

Not so much any more. DNxHD is the new ProRes.

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Not so much any more. DNxHD is the new ProRes.

 

Bold. I've been using DNxHD since 2005 on my Avid and lately transitioning away from it to Pro Res. Especially since MC added Pro Res support and my ARRI writes to Pro Res. I think DNxHD is probably the new Pro Res to PC based Avid editors. I still use DNxHD out of Resolve every shoot to turn in dailies for post houses, but I wouldn't call that DNxHD taking over. Just sustaining the Avid workflow that's been around for years. They both have their niche, but not sure there is any sort of global takeover that I can tell.

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Not so much any more. DNxHD is the new ProRes.
Bold. I've been using DNxHD since 2005 on my Avid and lately transitioning away from it to Pro Res. Especially since MC added Pro Res support and my ARRI writes to Pro Res. I think DNxHD is probably the new Pro Res to PC based Avid editors. I still use DNxHD out of Resolve every shoot to turn in dailies for post houses, but I wouldn't call that DNxHD taking over. Just sustaining the Avid workflow that's been around for years. They both have their niche, but not sure there is any sort of global takeover that I can tell.

 

We're Mac over here and we've completely stopped delivering ProRes. Unless a client requests something specific, we deliver DNxHD -- it seems to be what most people are expecting now.

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When did you buy your Alexa? I suspect ARRI won't be making any more ProRes cameras. Its a pain in the ass and expensive to get your hardware able to generate ProRes files. Apple keeps a pretty strong lock on that.

 

I was a bit surprised to see the Blackmagic camera have ProRes support, but either Blackmagic already jumped through all of the hoops with Apple to do so and just left it in, or those FCP X users are exactly who they are trying to market the camera to anyway.

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We're Mac over here and we've completely stopped delivering ProRes. Unless a client requests something specific, we deliver DNxHD -- it seems to be what most people are expecting now.

 

Aaron, are your clients integrating it straight to an Avid timeline for delivery in another method? Such as Mpeg2 for Fast channel or the like? If it's meant to go back to an Avid, then for sure that makes sense. But I would be curious to know what they are doing with it after you take it. I certainly have no qualms with DNx. I've always been blown away with it's tiny file sizes while keeping more quality than you think is possible. But from my POV, it seems outside of AVID or VLC or the like to be able to use DNxHD as it needs to be licensed from AVID. So trying to get a point of reference how it's being used. And I keep thinking it has to do with going straight back to an AVID. Of course I could be wrong :)

 

@Aroma. Got Alexa last November. You can buy a DNxHD option for it, but if post houses don't want me to do my own dailies to DNx, they want the logC Pro Res files directly and use them in MC6 usually.

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Not to sure about that ProRes comment everything I have delivered or come across on set/post depending on camera package and edit spec is ProRes.(among DPX/EXR etc)

If the edit house dictates DNxHD then they'll make them at the same time.

Most of the the recorders I own or DP/DIT use are recording ProRes. Hell the most popular and most used format from Alexa is ProRes.

Not one episodic shoot I know of in NYC/LA right now is not shooting ProRes for handing off to dailies team to archive and deliver.

Not taking a dig at DNxHD its got its place just fine in Avid workflow but for all the base still on FCP 7 the others looking at Premiere Pro and over NLE's its still ProRes.

Both Avid and Apple have a nice hefty fee to license ProRes to 3rd parties . And be aware each ProRes compliant device from recorder to app can vary . Apple doesn't write anything for the companies they adhere to Apple's spec which isn't always correct (QT Gamma and Color shift)

 

Also that shiny cam Chris has can do more then even the HDSDI he has on it . ProRes via internal Alexa SXS recording does 12-bit 4:4:4 ProRes while HDSDI tops at 10-bit 4:2:2

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If your FCP7-based, then sure - ProRes it is. Time will tell, I guess. Its not dead, and its a great codec, but without being able to write from a PC and everyone waning off final cut its becoming more and more rare for me to come across it. 2 years ago everything was ProRes. It all depends on if they open it up for cross-platform writing or if fcp x becomes worth a shit.

 

Anyone can download the DNxHD codecs. One of my machines doesn't have Avid installed and I write DnxHD. On my laptop that has no pro apps I still have the codec so I can view posted files within Quicktime.

 

Most of my time is spent at a Mac-based facility and our workflow mainly consists of offline editing in 35 (which are what dalies are received as, but I think the DITs make multiple transcodes and we just take the 35s), then providing the source and an EDL to the color correction facility where they kick us back 175x for online and graphics / compositing.

Edited by AromaKat

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Well certainly I can let you in on the hacktastic secret you can make ProRes on Windows without having a DVS Clipster or other 150k+ system.

Little hacking but you can get it done with FFMpeg

 

Not for the faint of heart

http://tomellard.com/wp/2012/03/make-prores-video-on-a-pc/

http://ffmpeg.org/doxygen/trunk/proresenc_8c.html

 

Follow and try at your own time and risk.

It can be done and some limitations as far as reading in certain apps.

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Aaron, are your clients integrating it straight to an Avid timeline for delivery in another method?

 

I don't think this is usually the case, but I could be wrong. Once it leaves our hands I tend to pay less attention :)

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Well certainly I can let you in on the hacktastic secret you can make ProRes on Windows without having a DVS Clipster or other 150k+ system.

Little hacking but you can get it done with FFMpeg

 

Not for the faint of heart

http://tomellard.com...-video-on-a-pc/

http://ffmpeg.org/do...oresenc_8c.htmlnds

 

Follow and try at your own time and risk.

It can be done and some limitations as far as reading in certain apps.

 

Cool tip!

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Several film festival asked for my son's film ALONE TOGETHER in ProRes format. Ben used After Effects for many of the film's effects, but his editor was Sony Vegas.

 

Here are the many, many steps for Sony Vegas to ProRes. I think they would work from Premiere, too, but I don't know about straight from After Effects.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yppdAJfLFWI

 

- Carl

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