Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Beaver

What is the current video camera hotness? $1000-2000 budget.

Recommended Posts

Been a while since I looked at video cameras. Last time I was interested in buying one, the 7D was what's happening. I think however, I would prefer a straight video camera to a DSLR with video capabilities. Been so long since I looked into this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was looking at the black magic cameras but ended up going with the Canon 5d mk iii because the Magic Lantern hack allows you to capture full HD in true RAW. Most Canon cameras do support raw with the lantern hack (I've already tested it on my T2i) but the aliasing looked pretty bad and because it's hardware limited to SD card speeds you only get standard def resolutions on the consumer line. The 5D uses CF cards so it can handle the full buffer at 1920x1080+ res and the mk iii also has reduced moire and less rolling shutter. I purchased a $10 broken camera on ebay and used Canon's "loyalty program" to trade it in for a refurbished 5D mk iii for $2400 while Amazon has a new one listed for $3,300 so you save almost a thousand bucks.

http://shootthecenterfold.com/canon-loyalty-program/

 

If you go with the black magic 2.5k, keep in mind it has a non-removable battery and a pretty massive 2.3x crop factor so you'd need wide lenses (a 35mm lens essentially becomes a 80mm on the 2.5k micro 4/3 version). The 4k cinema camera looks far more interesting as it is a full frame camera but still has some limitations like the non-removeable battery and is $4,000. Some good things about the black magic cameras is the inclusion of Resolve 10 with the 2.5k and 4k versions. Workflow seems a bit better w/ the black magics as well since RAW is 'officially' supported rather than a 'workaround' with the Canon route.

 

So I guess it depends on how much you want to spend, if it's closer to $1k I'd say the black magic pocket camera or the just announced Canon 70d http://www.newsshooter.com/2013/07/01/canons-new-eos-70d-a-revolution-in-autofocus-for-video/ If you're closer to $2k+ I'd say 5d mk iii or if you're willing to get up to $4k then the black magic 4k cinema camera.

 

5d/Raw:

http://nofilmschool.com/2013/05/luke-neumann-aviv-vana-canon-5d-mark-iii-red-epic/

http://nofilmschool.com/2013/06/magic-lantern-raw-video-support-canon-cameras/

http://www.cinema5d.com/?p=17976

 

Black Magic:

http://philipbloom.net/2013/03/29/bmdmft/ (the 45 min video review is pretty extensive on the pros/cons of the 2.5k version)

Edited by superegophobia

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

eugh... non removable batteries seems like a serious "shoot yourself in the foot" thing...

 

how is that even remotely practical...?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

eugh... non removable batteries seems like a serious "shoot yourself in the foot" thing...

 

how is that even remotely practical...?

Yea an odd choice considering their target market. I guess people use those V mount battery packs but seems like a hassle (and more expensive) for smaller productions or if you're trying to stay light/handheld. Among other things the battery issue and the large crop factor made me stick with canon. The black magic cameras make nice images though. And the 4k version has no rolling shutter but the trade off is you loose a stop of dynamic range compared to the 2.5k version.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

eugh... non removable batteries seems like a serious "shoot yourself in the foot" thing...

how is that even remotely practical...?

 

Its not a camera you will just be wandering about with in your hands like you would with a DSLR. The BMCC is meant to be used on rails, and there are battery kits for that which mount right onto the plate.

 

The pocket was made for run & gun, and is the true competitor of the DSLR. The BMCC is more of an alternative to a RED setup imho.

Edited by AromaKat

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

pretty massive 2.3x crop factor

 

These days the real investment you make is in your glass not the body. Unless you really need the portability I feel like the pocket camera is pennywise and pound foolish you save on the camera but are investing in glass that's really limited.

 

At least with 60D or 70D you can buy lenses that are going to be good for full frame since the 1.5 crop factor is a lot more manageable and you have glass that can work and then if you want to trade up or rent a Blackmagic 4K, red, C300 etc for a shoot all your lenses still work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm in the same spot.

 

The BM pocket is dope but I agree about the glass, and the 4K is great but just sitting on that high price fence for my budget.

 

I also don't really have any good glass so I need to invest in that too, which makes the body price a bit of a dog.

 

Do DSLRs still shoot h264 natively? That's the thing that really bothers me, even if it is a higher quality form of the codec.

Edited by microdot

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

Do DSLRs still shoot h264 natively? That's the thing that really bothers me, even if it is a higher quality form of the codec.

 

Yep. There's a magic lantern hack that allows RAW capture but I haven't tried that out.

 

The 5D III has Canon support to output uncompressed through the HDMI port but you'll need a separate HDMI recorder.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Most Canon cameras can record RAW but the resolution depends on the model (CF card vs SD) as well as the aliasing/moire problems. 5D mk iii will give the best results.

 

Should mention there is the Nikon line of cameras that shoot video but I believe it's also h264 and (currently) doesn't have the kind of raw support that magic lantern has. There is also the Panasonic GH2/GH3 and I believe there is a firmware hack out there that gives better video quality than the built in h264 compression but I haven't really looked into it that much.

Edited by superegophobia

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Those videos are comparing the h264 compressed version of the 5d vs the BMCC. I probably wouldn't have upgraded cameras to a 5d if that was the best results it could get but the magic lantern raw hack seems to make a huge jump in quality, both dynamic range and sharpness. So that's what tipped the scales IMO.

 

http://www.cinema5d.com/?p=17976

"The 5D is just as strong as the BMCC, providing maybe a bit more dynamic range. Where the cameras differ in terms of RAW is one big thing: Noise. The 5D mark III can shoot indoors at ISO 1600 and theres almost no noise while the Blackmagic starts to get ugly at this point.

The noise from the BMCC is also apparent when raising the blacks in a shot.

Moire and aliasing is another big big issue on Blackmagic and there is very litte of that on the 5D RAW. The cleanness of the shots of the 5D RAW in general is extremely pleasing and jumps at you when you sit in front of the RAW images."

 

Update 07.22.13

Having played with RAW a bit, I think the quality is great. Currently the hardest thing to deal with is the lack of real time playback of raw footage on the camera to check stuff. You can play it back in black in white but it previews slow similar to waiting for a ram preview in AE. Hopefully Magic Lantern will someday add a feature to let you save a proxy or h264 on the SD card for review. Or when they port ML to the latest canon firmware that would hopefully allow you to record raw to the CF card while using something like a Ninja or Hyperdeck Shuttle for review playback.

Edited by superegophobia

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...