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superegophobia

Adobe CC, thumbs up or down?

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If Adobe CC embraced this it would be awesome!

 

 

or it is pretty sad. Companies will just buy these, hire the cheapest labor they can find from around the world and race to the bottom. Do you really think they will pay you to sit on the beach and phone shit in? How will a producer stand behind you and say hurry up.

Edited by pixel_pimp

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This has been proposed over and over again, but well, I don't see it happen any time soon. Maybe if you live in a town with a 1GBit fibre access, but in my little world I still have a crappy 1.5Mbit DSL and uploading a 30 MB vid to Vimeo takes 20 minutes and on my iPad I have a 1GB highspeed quota... Unthinkable to get any work done via remote desktop...

 

Mylenium

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damn, i'd buy those nvidia things for myself. if the streaming is smoother than remote desktop of course. I would love to be able to work at a cafe and have some grunt without lugging a gaming laptop around. And without potentially loosing all my work if i lose my laptop or drop it.

 

also team render really needs an internet enabled option. If i have a bunch of computers at home. I should be able to order them to render, while i'm on my laptop anywhere else in the world. Maybe they should have like server daisy chaining? So i send a job from my laptop outside. and then the server at my place will handle the rest of the job and then just send me back jpgs.( or whatever i request). And for me this would be seamless inside cinema.

 

That would be sweet...

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Some info about upgrading CC 2014 on Todd's blog:

http://blogs.adobe.com/aftereffects/2014/06/plug-ins-settings-after-effects-cc-2014-13-0.html

 

Interestingly with the new "2014" naming I take it they are going to save bigger features for yearly updates and smaller or bug fixes during the year? Isn't this the same cycle they were doing before CC (and one of the arguments why Adobe said CC would be better with continuous "big feature" updates?)

 

In some ways I actually appreciate the different version naming if it breaks plugin compatibility for technical reasons like it says on the blog. Would suck to do a point update mid project to find broken plugins. But as others have mentioned, then AE absolutely needs a unified backwards saving system like illustrator that can go back multiple versions.

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Interestingly with the new "2014" naming I take it they are going to save bigger features for yearly updates and smaller or bug fixes during the year? Isn't this the same cycle they were doing before CC (and one of the arguments why Adobe said CC would be better with continuous "big feature" updates?)

Well, there never was anything different. Ultimately some claims about CC were bald-faced (marketing) lies to begin with, including and especially that "continuous update" thing. Makes no sense from a technical POV. Why would anyone even dream of writing his application core only once and then patch it for the next 10 years? You need to refresh you base install at some point to start with a clean slate. How big or minor those changes are is subject to personal opinion. Even a complex "under-the-hood" rewrite of a whole feature could be perceived as minor simply because the workflow isn't affected, while at the same time a simple feature that adds some new button could be a big deal to some... Either way, there's still some surprises left for this year no doubt like a new Cineware/ 3D thingy, C4D support in Photoshop, cross-application support for 3D between both apps (formerly PS Live 3D)...

 

Mylenium

Edited by Mylenium

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To have 2 installs is mildly annoying yet its nothing new. My thinking is in line with Myleniums in regard to the new install base. In the long run, everyone would be whining about how they just keep patching it and not keeping the base truly up to date and optimized. I don't see a reason why the 2014 edition needed a fresh install, but that doesn't mean there aren't optimizations made in the base, or perhaps laying down a foundation for something planned in the near future. Stuff we don't really see. Maybe its just a move to get everyone used to this approach for the most part, and did it to stay in line with other apps in the suite. Or, its simply the same yearly marketing gimmick they have always done. We will never really know, but in the end, I feel better knowing they aren't going to have the same base in 2020 with a gazillion patches and updates slugged in.


As already mentioned by others, I feel it would be really courteous of Adobe to offer an export method for older versions rather than just one version back. Even if some stuff is broken here and there it would be okay and expected. Just to make a common core export function. To not offer such a funtion is clearly a tactic to strong-arm CS6 squatters into migrating over.



Also... Since they are making small packages for photographers, web devs etc now I wish they offered a discounted package akin to what Production Premium was. I think that would make the price point a bit more attractive, especially now that they have a bunch of web / app dev stuff I will never use. I haven't ever installed about half of the apps available within in the Creative Cloud manager.

Edited by AromaKat

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Totally agree about the discounted packages. Adobe Creative Cloud really needs tiers. Give me an A/V package and I'd be much happier swallowing the "subscription" model each month.

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At least this way the AE guys have leeway to introduce something really, truly shockingly innovative - you know, like folders in the timeline or something batshit crazy like that, without being shackled to supporting whatever dusty old layering setup it is that's currently grinding grooves into my CPU. :P

 

I've been whining about layer sets for almost twelve years now...I'm beginning to think that may not ever happen! :o

 

Cf

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Also... Since they are making small packages for photographers, web devs etc now I wish they offered a discounted package akin to what Production Premium was. I think that would make the price point a bit more attractive, especially now that they have a bunch of web / app dev stuff I will never use. I haven't ever installed about half of the apps available within in the Creative Cloud manager.

I could go without the web stuff, but I'm not sure what a "Production Premium" package today would look like. Even in the past it always seemed to me that if you had such a package there would come the odd job the next morning that required you to use InDesign or Flash and then you felt something missing... It's difficult to encompass a designer's needs in a generic sense and formulate them in a reduced program package, given the multitude of different file types we use or get handed from clients. Ironically with script panels now being HTML5 based even the web tools could become more relevant for developers of such scripts, making it even more questionable which programs to strip...

 

Mylenium

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In 15-odd years I've never needed InDesign or Acrobat once. The PP was exactly all the Apps I use and very few of the ones I don't (eg Speedgrade) Some designers are broad-based, some more specialised in their software use.

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Yeah, sure depends. We used those tools regularly, despite being primarily a video-centric outlet. When a client has nothing else, you have to make do extracting a logo from some pasted contours in an ID file or SWF or extract some images from a PDF...

 

Mylenium

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Thumbs up.. access to all adobe programs, easy to use updater, fair priced imo (cheaper would be ideal of coure). I haven't had any problems and really dig the ease in which all the programs shake hands now. Only gripe for me is that my day job doesn't have it yet so I have to remember to down-save when doing stuff from home.

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damn, i'd buy those nvidia things for myself. if the streaming is smoother than remote desktop of course. I would love to be able to work at a cafe and have some grunt without lugging a gaming laptop around. And without potentially loosing all my work if i lose my laptop or drop it.

 

also team render really needs an internet enabled option. If i have a bunch of computers at home. I should be able to order them to render, while i'm on my laptop anywhere else in the world. Maybe they should have like server daisy chaining? So i send a job from my laptop outside. and then the server at my place will handle the rest of the job and then just send me back jpgs.( or whatever i request). And for me this would be seamless inside cinema.

 

That would be sweet...

 

Yo Vozz - I've been thinking about this too. But as it's based on Bonjour the local comms have to be over LAN. The assets and .c4d files are shared with P2P so those could well be sent from a remote location. If you are happy to leave all your hot computers on when you leave the house, why not use VNC or likewise to send your file to computer number 1 and kick off team render that way? you're right, but it's just not designed for internet. maybe a team render update could allow a watch folder or dropbox-style inbox that rendered out the received project files. in fact if i wasn't an idiot i'd go through the SDK and see if you can't already. I haven't even set up a Growl notification for my render queue, so i am not the guy for the task.

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I have not use it myself but I have heard that Logmein's "Cubby" is a great way to do exactly this. I personnally use our FTP and Logmein to start/stop and check on renders from home and manage things remotely. I have even used this to do some basic versioning remotely from my latop and phone.

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I can imagine the date night with the girlfriend: "Well, this is just great. Stop playing with your phone! Won't you at least pay me some attention?"

 

- "Give me ten minutes, I'm setting off a render..."

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Hhahahah.... the sheep push notification would be the worst. But overall it is a handy tool to check. Yes you need to make sure not to use it on date night with the wife/girlfriend but it's pretty nice. Suck that the free version is gone but still worth the dough IMO.

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One thing that I have found worth the upgrade (and this appears to be a very personal anecdote): AE CC used all of my available RAM for any project, no matter how small. I'm talking 15.78 GB for a three layer comp with 38 megs left unused. It would grind my system to a halt and often AE too. I tried many ways of fixing it with no help. Adobe wasn't much help. I just got to suffer.

 

However, 2014 doesn't do this. Period. And it's really nice. In fact, I am RAM previewing and I have nearly 3 gigs of RAM unused.

 

So, that's been worth it for me.

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I find it to be pretty lame. And it broke my blackmagic output.

 

Is it worth upgrading? Well, if you are on CC, why not?

 

Masked effects on layers are great actually, makes doing spot colour corrections etc very clean and contained, rather than having deep comps with multiple copies of the same layer, each having a track matte. Love this.

 

HDMI out to a second screen used as a monitor might come in handy.

 

.exr loading seems faster - but also flaky? I keep getting half-loaded files displayed - so the bottom half of the screen is blank. Need to investigate this before doing a bug report, it's only during fraction-res previews, full renders are fine.

 

One silly bug - if you're outputting a movie, and it over-writes a file that's referenced in your comp, then as soon as the original file is deleted AE complains that it's missing and can't be imported. Well, duh, that's because you just deleted it you dullard. Sometimes this is followed by a crash. Which is nice. This has been reported.

 

And disk cache keeps on holding onto the wrong frames, but nothing new there.

Edited by ChrisC

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Without getting too philosophical about it, having been a user of several apps for a long time and seen the debate from the inside and outside, my general observation since the CC thing started are pretty much:

 

1) This is about money first and foremost. While the more frequent updates can in theory benefit users, this is really about Adobe making more money selling the same products, plain and simple. If they couldn't make more money at it there's no way they would go to all the trouble and expense to try and make it happen.

 

2) There has been no consistent vision as to how logins and updaters should work, how the technologies from one generation to the next will coexist, etc. They change how these management features work, literally every version seems like, going back to CS6. Big thumbs down on all of these "managing the suite" type technologies. I guess they absorbed decactivation into the CC login aspect so at least that's a plus / no longer need to worry about accidentally uninstalling without deactivating and having to f-ing call Adobe to fix it.

 

To me the most frustrating part of the process now is dicking around with the login stuff. The stupid thing logs me out for no apparent reason all the time. And because CC is tied into an Adobe web site login, which we know about their security issues in recent years, means I have that in 1Password. Which means every time I start up, if CC randomly has decided it is no longer logged in at restart, now I have to open 1P and dig up my damn password and spend 2-3 minutes dorking around with the CC login widget. The font thing is wonky too, the way it ties into that TypeKit web site and forces you to go back and forth to see if something really did just install on your machine.

 

3) The original claim was "instead of a bunch of big features at once, then small bug fixes, you'll get more big features but over time, yadda yadda", which that hasn't panned out based on what I've seen. The number of new features over the course of a cycle is about the same as the old "big release" cycling. The products are still just as buggy at the x.0 point and require bug fixes throughout the year. In short, that was a marketing ploy to get people to buy into the new subscription model. While the number of new and improved features is pretty good, it was always pretty good and hasn't changed appreciably.

 

4) The one positive is, I remember when the whole suite cost like $3000 for a license and I think it was around $1500 for a once-every-18-month upgrade. The fact you can have every tool in Adobe's arsenal at your disposal, and plenty of useful assets like Fonts included, for $50 a month, which works out to $600 a year... isn't too bad. Photoshop by itself used to cost over $600, and i think $299 for an upgrade. So, if you can pull in one small job a month aside from your other expenses, you've paid for it. For hobbyists, I agree it's not a good deal. However those folks do have other options, choosing individual apps for I think $19/month.

 

5) Most important: software quality... it's still solid. AE obviously needs to hit the mark on all the "performance promising" they did in January, but on the whole, it's still a pretty powerful suite of products. There is some performance optimization going on piecemeal in Photoshop, Illustrator... Premiere is the clear winner in "we decided a couple years ago to make things faster and more efficient, and we did what we said" sweepstakes. AE the clear loser. Overall, the best game in town for 2D pixel pushing apps, but there's definitely an element of complexity and confusion that didn't used to exist, because of the CC environment.

Edited by Zmotive

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