Guest bennett Report post Posted February 26, 2004 It seems that the only people that feel these trends are overdone are designers. I'm fairly positive that the general public is largely unaware of the impending revolution to overthrow "dripping vector stuff". While I too wait patiently for the slow and painful death of these gimmicks, I recognize that they serve as an entry point for a lot of graphic artists. While "circles, 45 degree angles and abstract 3D" don't make a designer, it opens the door for many to discover their own visual voice. As a rookie, my frustration comes from the struggle to create something entirely unique and "trend-free". Leading instead of following. My contempt for these trends grow knowing that there are people making a living using Shine without restraint while there are struggling artists making an honest effort to bring something different to the table. I guess that this is really in response to jayse's comments. I don't think that designers are complaining that other work is "played out" as much as we are eager to be inspired by "the next big thing" that changes the way we approach design. Until that "big thing", there will always be people using Asian-inspired, illegible type to appear "exotic" and bad techno music to be "hip". Oh well, what do I know. Phew, I feel better now... Govinda, do you really know somebody at Del Monte? Jello cups are "off the heezy"! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest jayse Report post Posted February 26, 2004 Just never forget, especially if you're a rookie, that great artists like Michaelangelo copied and copied and even stole artwork from his teacher to copy and copy and copy... Van Gogh wanted to become a dark, realistic portraitist until his brother convinced him to 'follow' the trend then popular of using a paint knife rather than a brush and not using any black. Vincent did this - copied and copied and did the latest trends. He even copied the 'flat' art that was trendy in Japanese art. Pablo Picasso said, "Good artists copy. Great artists STEAL." Andy Warhol started copying stuff when he attended an art exhibit for 'simple things' in which he was inspired. He made fun of copying so much that he even made a copy of the Mona Lisa - 20 times in different colors and called it his own - much to the horror of 'proper' art critics. I think the lesson here is: don't be afraid to CREATE. Just DO it. As the awesome director of too many music videos to name, Michel Gondry said, "Inspiration is often the connection of two sources. You bring them together and make something new." He always admitted to 'stealing' ideas - then he'd simply combine it with some other 'borrowed' idea to make something new like a video for bjork or Beck or Foo Fighters or Daft Punk. It's a good way of working. But if new designers on this board see these threads - it's just a way of zapping their creativity. >> off to make my vectors drip... er... with some elk and rainbows. // jayse Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bennett Report post Posted February 26, 2004 Actually, jayse, it was TS Eliot that wrote "Good writers borrow. Great writers steal." Not Picasso. I said that I was a rookie not a 5-year-old. Thanks for the lecture though. Now "I believe I can fly. I believe I can touch the sky..." Like igor said, copying is not enough. Your Van Gogh example reiterates that using trends can serve as a springboard to originality. Your Gondry quote supports synergy not following a trend as a creative process. While some designers may be discouraged by this thread, some (like myself) will take the initiative to explore. Free hilighters and jello cups to whoever can take this thread into a more positive direction! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest parallax Report post Posted February 26, 2004 Art/Design = Copying, Skill and 'chance' combined in a delicous take away meal. If i have never seen a car, how can i create a new one? If i never saw my parents walk, how would I be able to walk? If i now walk across a junkyard, and i happen to trip and fall, and by accident 4 wheels are connected to my limbs, did i now invent a new form of transportation? Or did i combine the concept of walking and 'riding'? True originality barely exists. Maybe originality is about connecting the dots? Not really a positive addition to this thread, so on that note i like to add: "Off da heezy" 8) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest fredcamino Report post Posted February 26, 2004 i think you also have to remember that theres not always the time and the money and the inspiration to be totally original with every project. if someone is only paying you so much to do such and such, under such and such constraints, in such and such amount of time, chances are, if you are human, you are going to say "eff it" and pull something out of your ass that you know the client will like, but is not necessarily the most original thing in the world. you also know that the majority of the time, a client isn't even going to accept your freshest most original work, so in the event that you do come up with something new, chances are your client will say... "well can you make it more like.. THIS". and you do it because you got them bills to be paid. lastly, some of us (well i can only speak for myself) are not geniuses and are not, nor ever will be, great artists in the realm of michaelangelo, picasso, and gondry. we're just lucky that someone wants to pay us to do what we do. it's just like govinda said, in the safety and theoretical realm of academia (and the internet) we can do just about anything, but once we fall into the real world its all highlighters and jello cups, shine effects and vector drips. all this said however, i still get sick of seeing elk surfing on rainbows. well mostly the elk really. because i just dont GET IT. someone let me in on the joke, please! to me the elk are like the trucker hats of the design world. at first it was kinda funny, "hey look! an elk! teehee" and then they started showing up every where and suddenly justin timberlake is sporting an $600 elk t-shirt and the girl your sister babysits just bought a similar elk t-shirt from target and then you walk down melrose and you start freaking out because you stop seeing people and just start seeing elk with every glance. it's enough to drive you nuts. but maybe to give this thread the positive spin it needs, we should all collaborate and come up with the next big thing. my thoughts are leaning towards developing a lightly buttered toast look to everything. just the lightest of crunch will do. i'm going to work on this now that i have some free time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest jayse Report post Posted February 26, 2004 Fred you get the highlighter. Bennet - if you're not five you probably understand that Picasso was probably alluding to a great phrase, in fact, 'stealing' it and making it his own in the process. (oooh - i like it even more this way) Also, I've heard it was said by Steve Jobs when Apple 'stole' the mouse idea from Xerox and also then by Bill Gates when Microsoft 'stole' the visual gui idea from Apple. But i'm glad you get inspired no matter what. it's a dayum good thang! Parallax - very well said. You copied ur parents walking? Shame!!! - it is, after all - the latest trend. Everybody's doing it, have you noticed? I'm going back to basics on all fours. Who's with me???! ;-P And Fred... the Elk, LoL - I love your description The Elk Well, I'm no Elk-Expert - but - as far as I can tell the idea of a lot of this is simply 'HA! Whatev' I think it's an idea of randomness that most schooled designers really hate. We were taught: "Must be a REASON for EVERYTHING!" And so now we're like - how can you put stuff in your design that just has no reason whatsoever?? It infuriates people - yet talk to some of the best designers (as I've done for my courses and such) and they say "I just put random Sh*{ in to just f$(% with people." (actual quote) And Nostalgia But then, also, those elk and such are part of the positive trend in design that is MUCH needed (IMHO). Setting itself apart from the darkness of Se7en grunge, apart from the cold tech of 2advanced - it's a throwback to the days that most of us grew up in - the 80's and OP and Atari shirts mainly - 8-bit music (which is coming back! ha! www.8bitpeoples.com - check out i,cactus) - simplicity in technology - limited color silk-screen processes - cute lil video games - and then, away from all this damn technology - EARTH and it's cute lil creatures simply to remind us there's something else out there OTHER than cpu's and flatscreens. Dripping Vectors? Just the natural progression - next step. Vectors are so sturdy and hard and defined and perfect - time to mess 'em up and show you've mastered them. Plus - where else are you going to use all your time-consuming downloaded brush sets? :-P Me personally - I'm now making my vectors SMOKE! Next Trend To build on Fred's idea: Buttered toast look with a slight honey edge - oh but wait - the comserve video already did that. Dayum. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest parallax Report post Posted February 26, 2004 Oh my god, walking is like SO 20th century Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest fredcamino Report post Posted February 26, 2004 i do agree jayse that i really do know where the elk come from, and you're right, it is 80's nostalgia. which is HUGE right now. and i also agree that it isn't a bad thing. it's nice to see so much color back in design. all at once, it reminds me of this amazing onion article: http://www.theonion.com/onion3214/usretro.html. "Department of Retro officials are closely studying new developments in meta-retro," Williams said, "including a dance sequence in the new film Boogie Nights, which is simultaneously a '70s retro allusion to Saturday Night Fever and a late-'80s retro allusion to the Beastie Boys' seminal '70s retro video "Hey Ladies"—an homage to an homage, if you will. While all the facts are still not in, this much is clear: Now, more than ever, we must conserve our precious pop-cultural past, for it is our future." a-mazing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bennett Report post Posted February 26, 2004 Jello cups for everyone. Bonus hilighters to parallax, fred and jayse for their wit and charm. Obviously, everything "now" has something to owe to "then". Synergy is the foundation of invention. I like how parallax referred to originality as "connecting the dots". As for walking, I'd like to think that I developed that concept with a report entitled "The Benefits of Bipedal Mobility" at the tender age of 3. Good points have been made about how randomness and '80s nostalgia are a reaction to traditional design teachings. Is being "trendy" what we see as the use of these devices for the sake of being "trendy" without a legitimate reason. Most of what I've done so far are Frankensteins of what I've seen. Bits and pieces that I've "stolen" from others. Ugh. I feel like the John Nash of motion design except that I'm not as smart and only slightly schizophrenic. Ok, I'm nothing like Nash. I'd be receptive to the "buttered toast look". Is it low-carb? Like, everybody has, like, totally gone low-carb. PS - Van Gogh would have had to allude to something said by a 2-year-old since Van Gogh died in 1890 and T.S. Eliot was born in 1888. I have a bad habit of correcting people when I think they are wrong. "Bad Bennett. Bad." I'm going to sit in the corner now. Somebody call me when the next big thing comes out. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bennett Report post Posted February 26, 2004 Since I've helped to take this thread from a compendium of what NOT to do into a general rant on trends, I thought that I would add that I think snowboarding footage + "techy-Grid-GUI-Crosshair thingies" is played out. Actually, I just wanted to be one of the top 15 in total posts. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest jayse Report post Posted February 26, 2004 No not Van Gogh! Picasso!!!! Remember? He's much more modern. But thanks for the jello cups! Yum! And yes - Lo-Carb 'Monster's' are the S$*]! As is lo-carb buttered toast I'm sure. Fred - that meta-retro thing is too funny. An homage to an homage to an homage to an... >>off to enjoy my lo-carb jello cup, Monster and SafeWay Select Natural Spring Water - Ozonated! // jayse Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bennett Report post Posted February 26, 2004 Aha! Picasso! An even worse habit of mine is incorrectly correcting people. Now I'm just going to stay in the corner for some "quiet time". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest jayse Report post Posted February 26, 2004 hehe - no no no - design is lonely enough - come outta da corner and eat ur jello *throws one at you to start foodfight* // jayse Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest parallax Report post Posted February 26, 2004 JEL-LO! *note to self* look up jello on google Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest parallax Report post Posted February 26, 2004 *closes down google* mmmmmm...pudding! some people say i have to much time on my hand. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest theronin Report post Posted February 27, 2004 I did a short film for Channel 4 (UK) TV last year which is being repeated week starting March 1st... you can view a low res REAL player version here... http://www.channel4.com/health/microsites/...animated_minds/ The one i did is called Dimensions and yes it uses a lot of the styles that you all "hate" so feel free to slag it off but personally I'm pretty happy with it! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mugsy Report post Posted February 27, 2004 Hey... I just had to register and jump in on the played out design confab. I think design by its very nature tends to be trendy. Identifying visual trends and incorporating them into your creative vision is an important part of what we do. Conversely, I think a more interesting discussion would be one dealing with NEW styles and approaches, NEW inspirations, and NEW ways to develope the creative experimentation that leeds to NEW and FUTURE played out styles. Anyone? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest govinda Report post Posted February 27, 2004 Ahh, there's a thread for that "The Style is Now." Grab it and run man. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest dahl Report post Posted October 16, 2004 It seems that the only people that feel these trends are overdone are designers. I'm fairly positive that the general public is largely unaware of the impending revolution to overthrow "dripping vector stuff". I agree. (It's the same argument in all other design circles) I'm still a beginner with AE and I haven't really played with it since v.4 so I'm still easily impressed with tired design trends. It's also kinda hard to leapfrog over that, when you just want to learn since most tuts are about these effects. But hopefully by being a little naive how AE is "supposed to work", I can use these effects in a new way that will benefit me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SermonOfMockery Report post Posted October 16, 2004 this seems like an appropriate place to reference my thread from a few months back entitled "i just like whatever is cool and trendy. is that so wrong?", which you can read at http://www.mograph.net/board/viewtopic.php?t=1093 anyway, when is justin harder going to put out a new reel so i can bite him even more than i already do? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Palazzo Report post Posted October 17, 2004 Don't forget the heraldry art, family crest thing. Also: meaningless flourishes and western looking egyptian slab serrifs like: dolphin, quentin, and the such. As well as Fraktur fonts used anywhere and everywhere. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Timur04 Report post Posted October 20, 2004 and why the hell do I see a DJ turn table in every reel, well.. not every but most of them Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest chibosa Report post Posted October 20, 2004 *removes shot of dj turntable from reel* haha but i am a dj so thats why it was in there Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest unsub1 Report post Posted October 27, 2004 man, you guys like a lot of stuff! this is a really positive thread. good use of time! get to work. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest atslopes Report post Posted December 22, 2004 the avant garde font please stop using it ive seen it 200 times already :x Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
