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Full Sail: Where dreams go to die.


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#21 Guest_Tread_*

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 05:00 PM

Some of my teachers were complete crap, but between all the teachers and all the lab instructors in each class, ONE of them is bound to know their stuff.   

Hell, you've paid $35,000

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What about that doesn't seem right? 35 grand for access to maybe a few teachers who might know their stuff... that YOU have to find them? Oh, and I heard it's been jacked up to 40 grand. Sounds worth it.

#22 Guest_F to the Soong_*

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 05:17 PM

i dont think its worth it, i wouldnt recommend the school to anyone... BUT if i were talking to a kid thats already in the school who is complaining about it i would echo what most of the fellow full sailers have said already.

thanks for posting some of the instructors names amy, i forgot their names and have been meening to get in touch with them again...

Matt, Scott, Mac, and Eric are all really godo teachers that have been very helpful to me in the past.

#23 Guest_amydot_*

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 05:47 PM

What about that doesn't seem right? 35 grand for access to maybe a few teachers who might know their stuff... that YOU have to find them? Oh, and I heard it's been jacked up to 40 grand. Sounds worth it.

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In actuality, I found that most of the teachers knew their stuff pretty well, with the occasional sprinkling of crap (especially amongst the lab instructors). I can only think of one real teacher whom I felt completely wasted my time, though most of the general education "teachers" were horrible as well. Other than that, the teachers themselves knew what their field for the most part. (Though some were not the greatest at actually teaching, they knew what they were doing...but I have found that to be true at any college. They simply have no training in education.)

Not to say the school is not ridculously overpriced, which it is, or that it was perfect, which it wasn't...but for me, it really worked. I'd still consider going somewhere like Creative Circus for formal design education though.

#24 Guest_amydot_*

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 05:51 PM

hey let me ask you, do they still have that class where you create a 3d game? i think the options were either a 3d shooter or racing game.

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I've heard that it's changed since I graduated, but when I was there, it still existed. We also had an "Intro to 3D" class where we could use as many poly's as we wanted and so create much cooler things in 3ds max. I think the 3D gaming teacher's name was Andrew McPhate? Scott Cook was the I3D instructor.

thanks for posting some of the instructors names amy, i forgot their names and have been meening to get in touch with them again...

Matt, Scott, Mac, and Eric are all really godo teachers that have been very helpful to me in the past.

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sure thing. let me know if you need any of their e-mail addresses or whatever.

#25 Guest_Sao_Bento_*

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 05:52 PM

I'd still consider going somewhere like Creative Circus for formal design education though.

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I don't know anything about the place, but they can't come up with a better name than “Creative Circus” ?

#26 Guest_F to the Soong_*

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 06:36 PM

^^^ i wouldnt say that, a lot of talented people have come out of full sail, with potential to do bigger things than work at a sign shop (nate, chris, and some others on this board)

amydot, yeah i think it was andrew, that guys a giant deuche bag... i need to add him to my list... ahh yes the list. Scott Cook is cool though

#27 Guest_Deepsky_*

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 07:11 PM

Tell Keith Richardson that you want to work on something with him - he is very knowledgeable and always willing to stay after hours when he can (atleast while I was there he was) - 3 years in Los Angeles I'm still running into situations where little tips and tricks I learned from him are showing up as useful.  All of the sudden "when the hell will I ever use this?" turns into "oh... I guess he did know what he was talking about."  I'll never forget, the very first project I did for VH1 used an EXACT technique that Keith taught it in class that I thought I would never use.

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Keith Richardson is still there right? He was my favorite teacher there, I was in the first class he started the After Effects club or whatever he called it on Friday nights in 2001. I went to a few of them but labs and other classes always prevented me from attending. Does Keith still have his site up, would be sweet someone to send that to me.

As Full Sail goes, you can be very bitter or you can make the most of it like Chris Kelley said. I pay 500 a month in loans for that damn Associates degree, but in the end to think about it the school does push you to work hard and really broaden your knowledge and teach you to learn shit on your own. I came out of the school working a different field than attended from the beginning.

It is a bitch getting a job after graduation and I don't know how the school comes up with 90% placement. It took me 4 months to find the first job on my own. I kept in contact for a little while with classmates, 2 got interships and haven't worked in the field since, 2 others went back to web design and the other, the most talented got a job on his own in Hawaii. Hmmmm, they placed 2 out of 30 classmates a job, that's not 90%. This was years ago though, maybe some are working now? But of course the school does teach you how to look for a job on your own and straight tells you it's going to be hard and you need a good portfolio.

Yes the school is overhyped....but it's pretty....and has metal brushings everywhere....

I do agree that their Bachelor degree is a joke. The Associates is not, just work harder for a better portfolio. At least you found places like this forum for inspiration. Keith and other teachers didn't foward us to places on the web at the time.

Like was already said, meet talented hard working students their and collaborate. Also keep in touch, their Alumni online sucks.

There design class is ok, I got to make a clay sculture and draw, and spin the color wheel! Woo hoo! lol. Really now, this school so SO is not a design school, it's mostly technical. I do wish I didn't have to pay for 4 months of Learning Director and Lingo along with the dead program Creator. Whatever, it was fun and I'll be paying for it the next 20 years.....wow. :D

#28 Guest_newtonboyy_*

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Posted 01 December 2005 - 07:18 PM

gynocomastia,

sorry to hear that your experience at fullsail is not the greatest. i also went to fullsail and was blessed to work with, and still do, some of the greatest guys i've ever met. what i found there, just like any other place, (and by place i mean anywhere with people) is that there is going to be the majority of the people there that would rather complain and point the finger. i've been there myself. the only thing that sucks about that, is when your finished, you've expended all that energy and have not furthered yourself as a person or a designer. basically what i'm saying is that it is a complete waste of time. how about instead of doing that, refer back to Chris Kelley's post (nice one btw Kelley) and try and get the most out of what your doing while your doing it. i think you'll find it more rewarding, and a lot less frustrating at the end of the day. If you push yourself with hard work and dedication, i think you'll find that you'll have very little time to become frustrated. hope it gets better for you and good luck.

just my piece

blake

#29 Guest_Deepsky_*

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Posted 02 December 2005 - 11:45 PM

I was just on the Full Sail alumni and checking the forum. There's some threads on how the school sucks. There was a Fullsailsucks.com but was taking down even though Full Sail lost the case in court. They have a lot of court cases filed against them for false advertising and many other things.

check this;
http://www.geocities...ullsailexposed/

Just to clarify, I don't hate the school and enjoyed my experience there but the school definitely needs changes and bring there price way way down. There digital media program went up $10,000 in 4 years?! wow...ouch

#30 Guest_fredcamino_*

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Posted 02 December 2005 - 11:50 PM

http://www.theonion....tent/node/30632

#31 Guest_govinda_*

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Posted 03 December 2005 - 03:05 AM

I've got a new idea on how to judge a program.

Does anyone out of the design program go on right away to being a director? Think United Bread circa 2001 (Saiman, Dooley and Won), JJ & Maithy circa 2003, Tronic circa 2001... Right out of school, bam! Directing music vids, installations and commercials.

It's not like everyone is going to get such a big break (and Tronic came out of Columbia architecture). But ideally you want a program with that shining Exit sign to a special room where you get touched by the directing angel, should you be ambitious *and* good enough. An 'out' at the top end like this is something very rare and very worth the money involved. Plus, having talented, ambitious people in your program pushes your work for years to come, unless you're prone to jealousy and decide instead to murder them as they sleep.

What creates this 'out'? A combination of people inside the school being good enough and people outside the school looking for the hot people coming out of the school.

Dunno, it's a new idea. I mean, most of the other ideas are already in play.

#32 Guest_SecMem_*

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Posted 03 December 2005 - 03:45 AM

As a current student of Full Sail, I'm appalled by the comments put forth in Mr. Gynocomastia's post. Obviously he doesn't realize that downloading background patterns for your webpage from Squidfingers is all you need to be a web designer.

Nah, I fully agree with a lot of both sides, particularly Chris' argument. I've witnessed my fair share of absolute horror coming out of my peers, but I've witnessed it coming from many of the teachers as well. However, it's comparative to the amount of self-declared "talent" that comes from anywhere in the world. You can't buy talent with a scholarship.

What Full Sail has given me is access to many software packages and introductions, however ample they might be, to industry-standard hardware. The people here really do care about what students do, whether they're motivated to learn and do their own independent studies or not. I think whether or not the school turns out shit for graduates is the sole fault of the attendees for wasting their money here.

Other teachers to make sure to utilize if they're still there:
Eric Richardson
Matt Foreman
John Taylor
Scott Cook
Mac Rutan
Brian Pieper
(I know Eric, Scott, Mac, and Brian are still around, but I'm not sure about the rest.)

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Eric is still here. Matt is still here. Scott is still here. Mac and Brian are still here. John Taylor is not, however. What did he teach?

I've heard that it's changed since I graduated, but when I was there, it still existed.  We also had an "Intro to 3D" class where we could use as many poly's as we wanted and so create much cooler things in 3ds max.  I think the 3D gaming teacher's name was Andrew McPhate?  Scott Cook was the I3D instructor.

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The 3D gaming teacher has changed to a different Andrew (I think). His name is Andrew Barras and he's pretty cool aside from the fact that he made us watch Strong Bad e-mails every single break.

The middleware engine we use, Renderware, is a joke though. At least the build the class makes you use is. It offers nothing even remotely close to the capabilites of a commercial engine these days. The final project has been to build a first-person shooter level (no artificial intelligence, so I guess it's not really a game that you're building) for a while now.

The good news is I hear rumors that they're dropping Renderware and that the students will soon be getting to work in UnrealEd.

I love games. I love building games. I love motion graphics. I love creating motion graphics. I love web. I love creating web sites (in everything but Flash). I love director. I love creating shockwave games regardless of how many people would like to play them or think director is a joke. I love 3D. I love creating low- and high-poly models for all purposes. I honestly don't care whether people think they're good or not, though it's certainly encouraging. I do it all because I'm obsessed with experimentation and I have the curiosity to learn all things that have anything to do with my three passions - games, music, and design. I've had my fair share of disappointment in Full Sail, but overall I think the school is a good fit for my wide-ranging interests. To me, my education here has been a breeding ground for study, experimentation, and research. Moreso outside of the classroom environment than in it. I may not have learned much from the school itself, but I've been stimulated by the school to go out and seek more knowledge on my own time and I don't regret the money I've spent for that small amount of coaxing.

Anyone who tells me to specialize in one thing will only see me do so if they're paying me for it. If I'm to hold a minimum wage job for the rest of my life because I refuse to pick one thing to dedicate my life to, I don't really give a shit. I don't care so long as I have the ability to create. I believe that is the passion you'll find that most people, not just Full Sail students, lack. It doesn't matter if you're a Full Sail teacher and you don't have professional quality work or if you're a student who only does projects that are related to Tool. If you enjoy what you do, then what's wrong with it? As soon as you believe that you can't learn anything from a particular individual just because you think you know more about a single piece of software or because you think you know more about design than they do, then you've missed the point of education. The point is to educate yourself, not to be a prick. And if you think you can educate yourself without the help of that specific individual, then get the fuck out of the class because it's obviously not helping you learn.

Edited by SecMem, 03 December 2005 - 04:46 AM.


#33 Guest_SermonOfMockery_*

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Posted 03 December 2005 - 04:44 AM

What Full Sail has given me is access to many software packages and introductions, however ample they might be, to industry-standard hardware.


i'm not sure the word "ample" means what you think it means. it doesn't really make any sense in that sentence.

#34 Guest_SecMem_*

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Posted 03 December 2005 - 04:49 AM

i'm not sure the word "ample" means what you think it means. it doesn't really make any sense in that sentence.

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Whoops. Yes, I've made that mistake before. I'm not sure why I keep telling myself that ample means "small amount". Meager is a more suitable word. I'm prone to make more mistakes when I rant.

Cheers.

#35 Guest_SecMem_*

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Posted 04 December 2005 - 01:33 AM

Duuuude. George Clinton is performing and holding a Q&A session here on December 5th. This school MUST be good.

#36 Guest_chriskelley_*

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Posted 04 December 2005 - 03:08 AM

Posted Image

#37 Guest_PlayerHater_*

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Posted 04 December 2005 - 08:30 AM

niceone

#38 Guest_kinojay33_*

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 04:24 PM

I agree nearly 100% that an education is what you make of it. Like anything in life, you need to make the best of a situation and become an alchemist of sorts. With the proper drive and desire, you can be a sponge & learn in any situation.

That said, I do think that a private enterprise that charges thousands of dollars for an education does have some degree of responsibility to its students. This includes hiring good educators (this means experts in their field AND being critical yet patient teachers--these types are usually lacking because the school is too cheap to pay them sufficiently, so the good talent finds other jobs) and provide the tools and resources that students need.

It's definitely necessary to have the passion to do work and research outside of the classroom if you want to be great at what you do. But if you're just passing time in classes & teaching yourself more at home than in class, then there's something wrong with the school.

That said, I know nothing about Full Sail, so I'm not levvying these accusations at them specifically. It's just sad to think that the guy who made that cheesy website with the beveled text & the B&W radial gradients probably was told he was doing a fine job.

#39 Guest_kinojay33_*

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Posted 22 December 2005 - 07:35 PM

Hey, what happened to the initial post? Did Full Sail send a cease and desist or something?

#40 Guest_Sao_Bento_*

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Posted 22 December 2005 - 07:45 PM

Hey, what happened to the initial post?  Did Full Sail send a cease and desist or something?

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The lesson is: always quote controversial posts in their entirety, just in case someone changes their mind and deletes it later.

On behalf of the Moderators here, I can assure you we did not remove the original post, and even if there was legal pressure, I can't imagine any of us would do something like that without explanation.




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